Correct spelling of PENNY

[j13m126]

No description provided.

[bhousel]

Oh yeah, @Contrib1043 put it to uppercase in c4611d7 in Aug 2021.
Then this came up for discussion in #6662 in Jul 2022.
I feel like people can't really decide how they want the brands that are styled uppercase.

I don't really have a preference, but it would be great if you could link to some discussion where people want this change. Mostly I don't want people flipping the names back and forth between Camel Case and Uppercase all the time.

[Contrib1043]

The company itself consistently uses the branding PENNY in uppercase, even in their imprint on their website they list themselves 'PENNY Markt GmbH' (see https://www.penny.de/impressum). Also most major other map providers uses PENNY as well. So I don't see evidence, that 'Penny' should be the correct or even a common spelling. On the ground the stores are spelled PENNY.

[j13m126]

Sure, but isn't it just a marketing trick to get your attention? To be instantly readable, even from far away?

To me, it's just not very pleasant to look at if some shops on the map are written in all caps while other aren't.
It also might disadvantage small shops and stores who can't afford big marketing/design teams.
Some brands are also not consistent in their branding, like "MYFLEXBOX" (impressum) and "myflexbox" (written on the parcel lockers). (https://www.myflexbox.com/de-at/).

That's why I would second the approach to copy the spelling from the impressum in the brand tag but only capitalize the first letter in the name tag.

Not to start another discussion, but to me its similar to including "GmbH" (type of legal entity) in the name tag as written in the impressum. Sure, one can add it to the brand or operator tag, but it's not of any use for the user and it's a waste of the limited screen space we have.

[UKChris-osm]

I've always thought that we should only use caps if the brand is an acronym.

However, personally I'd leave PENNY as it is for now, as looking at the Overpass link it seems almost all of the current POI's are marked up as PENNY, and would all need updating, unless a discussion is held regarding a bulk / automated edit to change them all.

[kjonosm]

I've always thought that we should only use caps if the brand is an acronym.

A bit off topic... But I generally wonder how to deal with acronyms that are commonly pronounced as a "normal" word as opposed to pronouncing each letter separately?

English Wikipedia seems to have the policy to draw the handling of using all-caps acronyms along that line. Only for brand or company names where each letter is pronounced separately Wikipedia uses titles in all-caps, e.g. IBM, BMW, KPMG, HSBC, DKNY. There are of course exceptions, like e.g. IKEA.

Following that policy within the subject of supermarkets, English examples would be to generally use Asda instead of ASDA vs. or Tesco instead of TESCO. The German equivalent would be to use Aldi instead of ALDI or Rewe instead of REWE. Penny in that regard would also be used instead of PENNY not being an acronym whatsoever.

Does it make sense to implement a similar policy in OSM (or NSI)? Or should this issue be ignored by just loosening spell checks on capital letters within NSI?

[Contrib1043]

At wikipedia they've got a bunch of rules on that topic (for reference https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Capital_letters#Acronyms and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Trademarks)

[Quote]
Trademarks in CamelCase are a judgment call ; the style may be used where it reflects general usage and makes the trademark more readable; however, usage should be consistent throughout the article.
OxyContin or Oxycontin – editor's choice
however: PlayStation only (camelcase preferred because Playstation is not widely used.)

[...]

Initial lowercase in certain trademarks almost never written any other way, such as iPhone and eBay, are accepted on Wikipedia.

[/Quote]

Personally I would suggest to judge each individual case (based primarily on what branding is used on the ground) rather than a general ruleset, which might not cover all cases anyway.

[urbalazs]

Underlying "brand:wikidata": "Q284688" refers to Penny so this tag with brand/name=PENNY is confusing. Either change the name in Wikidata, Wikipedia or merge the pull request to have a consistent naming.

Additionally, the Hungarian subsidiary calls itself as "Penny-Market Kft."

I also vote for Penny.

[Contrib1043]

When I look at their hungarian homepage, they seem to consistently use the uppercase spelling (same as in Germany...)

If it helps, I can adjust the wikidata record - it would then be consistent with the uppercase spelling of their parent company REWE on wikidata btw ;-)

[Cj-Malone]

The Wikidata label has no influence and no requirement on matching NSI. They serve different purposes.

Has there been a discussion somewhere supporting this? I wouldn't want this to be merged just for other people to come back and complain next week.

[bhousel]

I'm just going to merge this and accept the idea that we'll probably be flipping the names of German brands back and forth forever.